Discussion: AA Guide / Pathlist (Checklist)

[solithan]

Mod edit: I've copied this fantastic guide Solithan put together, deleted one reply with suspect malware in the signature, and left this open for commentary / feedback / discussion. This is a fantastic outline that deserves to be noticed & taken note of! Thanks Solithan!

Here's an updated version a bit more complete. ** Current threw SoD**

Ok I’ve made this as a check list for new and old Necromancers. If you ever wanted to know what AAs you “should” have or in what order to take them, consult this list. This is written from the perspective of taking a level one and pushing him up to 80 with 90%real/10%AA or maybe 80/20. Careful spending can get you very far in this class as we have very few “must haves”. Due to length I’m not listing the full details of each AA. Following this list you should have all the prerequisites needed to get the next one on the list as well as the appropriate level.

Format ** what to get ** when that ability becomes purchasable **

[__]First purchase up to Rank4 Innate Run Speed (level 51 for first 3 ranks, level 61 for next)
[__]Next get rank 1 of Mnemonic Retention (level 55)
[__]Next get rank 1 of Spell Casting Mastery (level 55)
[__]Get Rank 1 of this next Death Peace (level 66)
Now you should be at 18AAs
Go back to
[__]Spell Casting Mastery and get ranks 2 and 3
You should now be at 28AAs.
Now lets pick up some Damage
Max this AA line out
[__]Critical Affliction (level 65)
You should be at 64 AAs spent now. Are you lvl 70 yet?
If so go get this:
[__]Encroaching Darkness (level 70)
Then max:
[__]Gift of Mana (level 66/68/70)
At this point you should have 91 AAs spent.
You should be above level 70 at this point so work this next.
[__]Gift of Radiant Mana (level 71)
At 94 AAs spent its time to boost damage again.
Max this
[__]Affliction Mastery (level 70)
At this point you should have 121 AAs spent.
And time for more damage boosting abilities! Max this
[__]Blood Tithe (level 71)
Should be at 157 AAs and at least 75th level now.
[__]Go back and pick up rank 2 of Mnemonic Retention
[__]Then snag rank 2 of Death Peace (level 76)
At 163 AAs now hit
[__]Gift of Exquisite Radiant Mana (level 76)
At this point you should be at 178 AAs and at least 76th level preferably 80th
You guess’d it,…Time for more damage! Max this:
[__]Destructive Cascade (level 78) *come back to this once you hit 81 and finish maxing*
Then Max this:
[__]Greater Blood Tithe (level 76)
Now at 242 AAs Believe it or not you’ve maxed out your damage potential on your Dots so its on to some other stuff. At this point I’d suggest adding some survivability especially for raids.
Its hard to argue with this next AA so get it max’d
[__] Natural Durability
Often on raids and sometimes in groups we run low or out of mana believe it or not. Most often with mobs that DoT Drain our mana. A cool trick we get helps out a ton and I suggest getting it next.
[__]Blood Magic (level 70)
Here you should have 266 AAs
At this point I’d suggest a very useful AA that helps survivability on raids and in groups.
[__]Willful Death (66)

At this point its time to push all the way to lvl 85 if you arn't there already.
2 of the most powerful AAs we get come in at that level (3rd spire and deathbloom)

At level 85 we obtain access to a very powerful AA refered to as 3rd Spire. There is a prereq that is required. This AA is a "must have" and it has Teirs that apply to both solo and pet use.

[__]Fundament of Intellect - needed to get the Spires -
[__]Fundament: First Spire of Necromancy
[__]Fundament: Second Spire of Necromancy
[__]Fundament: Third Spire of Necromancy
These AAs are activated and temporary. Teir 1 boosts your chance to crit on your dots. Teir 2 boosts the damage of your pet and Teir 3 increases the damage of your crits. It is raw fact that Teir 3 is the most powerful Activated AA we get and its potential damage is far greater then the previous Teirs. Once you get 3rd spire, you'll never use any other.

If you have any problems with mana and Blood Magic doesn't cut it, here is your answer.
[__]DeathBloom

While it doesn't add damage it does allow you to keep your damage going significantly and the only reason its listed down this far on the list is because of the lvl 85 requirement. This AA will probably change the way you play.

Now go back and get ranks 3 and 4 of
[__]Mnemonic Retention

This will give you 12 slots. More slots means more dots = more damage. Simple.
Also at 85 more ranks of
[__]Destructive Cascade and
[__]Critical Affliction
Both further boost your DPS.



It is time to make a choice. Are you going to tap tank or use your pet. This is mostly a personal preference and some folks head down both paths at the same time but largely from here on out you either increase your pet dps or you increase your survivability in a fight while also boosting your life tap nuke damage. I’ll let you decide but lets Assume you want to head down both. I’ll highlight which of the lines should be best to take and assume the Rank 1 of each AA is more potent then others so often folks just grab rank 1 of the entire path then go back and fill in.


Necro are known for their utility. We get several AA in that respect. This utility can help the raider or grouper and either Tap or Pet line alike. The 350 AA range would be a good time to invest in some of these. Some folks argue “you can’t live without these” I don't know if that's true but they will certainly make life easier.

UTILITY

[__]Whisperwind
[__]Cloak of Shadows
[__]Spell Casting Reinforcement Mastery
[__]Call to Corpse
[__]Summon Remains
[__]Focus of Arcanum
[__]Harmshield
[__]Innate Invis to Undead
[__]Gate
[__]Levant
[__]Deathly Pack


SPIKE DPS can fall into either Tap Tank or Pet so I’ll list it next, however you’re probably best served by going down a path and picking these up later, post 500AAs.

[__]Wake the Dead
[__]Army of the Dead
[__]Rise of Bones
[__]Swarm of Decay
[__]Gathering Dusk
[__]Life Burn


TAP TANK

The key to tap tanking is being able to take the hits and heal more then you take.
Remember this: First avoid it, then mitigate it, then soak it.

[__]Combat Agility
[__]Shield Block
[__]Combat Stability
[__]General Sturdiness

Now that you can take the hits, let’s take care of part 2, dealing damage and healing. Bring your nuke damage up and the chance to critical heal, I’d go 1 for 1 on each.
[__]Spell Casting Fury
++[__]Fury of Magic
+++[__]Destructive Fury
[__]Theft of Life
And finally add this in to keep going threw stuns
[__]Persistent Casting



PET TANKING

Ok, much like you your pet gets similar AAs and the same theory applies: First avoid it, then mitigate it, then soak it. You’ll also want to boost his damage and pick up additional ways to heal him and keep him alive.

When dealing with your pet for any reason there are some great pet utility AAs that should be picked up, many guild make this a requirement to have a pet on raids. I will list by group by include numbers indicating purchase order.

UTILITY
[__]Suspended Minion (#1)
++[__]Persistent Minion

[__]Pet Discipline (#2)
++[__]Advanced Pet Discipline

[__]Pet Affinity (#3) *best way to keep pet alive is with buffs*

[__]Feigned Minion
[__]Companion's Relocation


SURVIVABILITY
[__]Fortify Companion – pet rune (#4)
[__]Companion's Agility – pet avoidance (#9)
[__]Study Companion – pet avoidance (#10)
[__]Companion's Durability – hp

DPS
[__]Death's Fury – chance to crit (#5 rank1)
++[__]Death's Wrath – increases crit chance
+++[__]Companions Fury – increases crit chance
[__]Quickening of Death – flurry (#6 rank1)
++[__]Companions Alacrity – increases flurry chance


HEALING
[__]Mend Companion (#7 rank 1)
[__]Companion's Blessing – pet heal (#8 rank 1)
[__]Replenish Companion

After 10 I’d go back in and fill in ranks and bounce around filling them all out.

[solithan]

I get asked some questions about the guide so I'll include this snippet:

The AA guide is just a guide and it works on the premise that an 80/20 mix will get enough AAs while you level, which might not be the case. Also it’s used as a check list to make sure you didn’t miss anything if you were following your own plan.

At some levels it is easier to get AA xp then others. This is because of the level difference between you and the mob and the difficulty of the mob. These break points are often referred to as Sweet Spots. The generally accepted Sweet spots are: level 65, 70, 75 and 80.

You can’t even begin to acquire AA until 51 and while some become available at 51 that is not a good time to stop. Just set to 20%aa and level up to 65. Once at 65 switch over to 100%AA and make sure you have up to 64AAs spent on the following: Run4, Mnemonic Retention1, Spell Casting Mastery3, Death Peace1,Critical Affliction6. At this point, while there are still AAs you could purchase your better served by advancing in level to the next bracket and moving along with the guide. With the higher levels come better gear and spells that outweigh the AAs you could get by staying.

Feel free to bank up to 30 before moving out of your bracket but do move on. The fear is that you might not be able to get AAs this fast ever again, but rest assured there is indeed a way to get the same rate at the sweet spot levels described above. Just consult the various hunting guides.

[Filter]

I just started using this again since I'm so gimpy and having something to look at on one page is great!

Thanks for this Guide!

[Nirruden]

Any suggested updates to the order of this guide, now that expansions have continued to roll out? I'm getting ready to pick up from level 72 and make the trek to 80 at about 60/40 or 80/20 so I can AA while I level, and want to do so in as efficient a path as possible (so I can spend more time levelling and less AAing "needlessly".

[solithan]

It, infact is up-to-date.

The cold truth is we got very few "must-haves" this expansion.

Just make sure your buying them in order.

Also if it says "Max this line" and you don't meet the level requirements for some rank, remember that to come back and get it when you are that level.

If you look at the UTILITY section you'll see Whisperwind, for example. This is from the newest expansion. While its very cool, its just utility and put in as such. Also just FYI the UTILITY section is in no particular order.

Encroaching Darkness is an example of an AA that made the must have section early in the list, as its amazingly useful.

I'll add to this list when the next expansion comes out, but remember I poll the community when making this list, so until the community gets around to testing the AA and commenting it probably won't make the list.

[Nirruden]

Thanks for the heads up on the relevance. (May want to put a note at the top noting which expansion it's current through, so as to minimize confusion. Just a suggestion.)

I departed during TSS, so coming back to a list like this that points out the big ones from the last three expansions is useful to me. I'll take a look through it tonight, see where my ~270AA are already spent, and then go find something to kite! Thanks for keeping the list up to date!

[solithan]

@ 270AAs you should still be working the Check Boxes.
Print off that section and compare them to what you currently have spent. Buy what you are missing.

Odds are you bought some stuff not on the list, no worries, just fill in where needed until you have all the check boxed materials and continue on from there.

Good Suggestion on the Currency Indicator. I see about adding something.

P.S. adjusted the Thread name(minor change) and Guide to include Expansion.

[Vanlor]

I will not debate order because that would go on forever due to differing play styles lol. Other than that on a glance-through the only thing that I strongly suggest you add as a necessary and imperative aa for dps is 3rd spire (and obv the path to get there). 3rd spire is, hands down, our best dps burst aa and can be used once every 10 min. I would probably still suggest getting all dot crit aas first (since 3rd spire is an overcrit mod).

[solithan]

Yeah, oops. Somehow that part of my revision didn't get added in. I noticed it earlier and I've added it back in now.

I think I was debating on how to add it in and ultimately decided to add its own paragraph and mostly because of the level in which it becomes available.

[Galkharasi]

I have to ask about survivability at 85 with 350 AA? Is this based on being able to solo decent XP with ease? I know it's a personal preference but I follow the "Early and often" approach because XP really is so much better 60-70 and easier at 75 than 85 due to mob HP counts for cons.

In my one experience with a raid guild, pre-SoD, they required lvl 80 minimum 500 AA, 800 for tanks and healers. Without good friends a 350 AA necro at 85 isn't likely to get many groups due to terrible sustainable DPs and low damage output in bursts. They will fold like a crapcake in a rainstorm, as will their pets. Soloing will be entirely based on hopefully hitting that 78+ mob with their snare and keeping out of range long enough to keep refreshing it as they drop less dots over time to conserve mana.

I took it to the other extreme, over 400 at 60 when I left Charasis. (killer place to AA at 60, btw. get a Staff of the Undead Legions and tap-tank with a DC pet from South Wing, can get a caster that hits 3x as hard as your summoned pet and buffs itself) Gained to 600+ AA at 70, 1500 at 75, and have gained over 250 since I hit 80. I'm surviving encounters that splat 85 raid wizards because I can take the hits long enough to get off an FD and I have Willful Death maxed. My regens are capped until 81, Planar Power is capped, Discordant Defiance is either capped for level or nearly so, meaning most (group mob) spells slide off me.

A fellow necromancer in guild is only 350 some AA at 78 and he ran OOM helping kill one golem in the path to Crystallos, I took down the golem and four oozes. It's nice having a guide, but considering what most necromancers have to take on by ourselves it's a bit sparse to keep the motivation up.

What I can say is; having been 1700+ AA and 85 in the past, I MUUUUUUUUUCH preferred AA'ing before I capped level this time. 300-400 AA at 75 in the time it took me to gain less than 100 at 85. (great place at 75, wind nymphs in DSH. at 70 they were 12%+ per kill and only took 5 dots with a pet. 75 took 3 dots and a pet for 8%. most mana efficient I had found at the time, plus the added necklace quest was an additional 18% per turnin) I usually killed 12 nymphs in a run so 144% AA there and if I dropped a necklace I usually dropped 1-3 putting it at 162%-198% for one run of nymphs. That sounds pretty bad AA compared to headshot but it took less than a 2 minutes per nymph, usually kiting 2-4 at a time, so roughly 20 minutes for that. 5-6 AA an hour, I never use pots. A geared pet helps but you have to keep more DPs on the nymphs to avoid them aggroing on the pet.

[Zeli]

I'm confused. What exactly are you asking?

[scrat]

I think he was more expressing his personal view on aa'ing and the path depicted above being contradictory to his preference- which is totally cool. The "right" path varies from player to player dependant on their style, time & goals.

The guide above is one that stresses the most important, the most impacting, DPS centric approach - which is the path most requested by those just starting out & typically ignorant of what the AA's actually do. Nobody knew pet flury would suck so bad until somebody bought it & tested it; this is a lessons learned for DPS freaks thing.

Many players, especially those in active guilds - find themselves placing more weight on survivability aa than finishing up pet dps lines or self utility.

Just to state the obvious - aa is an amplifying circular thing. The more you have, the faster & easier you kill. I remember being 67 and being totally godlike getting 4 per hour. Then at level 72ish I was getting 6-7 per hour and I was master of the universe. Now, at 85 I can get over 10 per hour and find myself parsing logs to see what I did wrong. Some feel cheated if they dont hit 15 per hour.

[solithan]

As Scrat said, its pretty much a guide but let me address some of your concerns as to why it was written the way it was.

You bring up the subject that I refer to as "Sweet spots".
The idea is that, at some lvls it is easier to get AAs then at others. This is true and I won't argue that, however, its not a blank check to stay that level forever picking up worth"less" AAs. There are better AAs at higher lvl breaks. Also, in many cases there are ways to get AAs at the same pace as the sweet spot you previously had. For example, while 5-6AAs per hour might seem like a lot, many folks will say that you should be closer to 8-10 with 16-20AAs on a burn.
(Check out the Subscriber section for more details)

I have to ask about survivability at 85 with 350 AA
According to the guide, THAT is the perfect time for you to question survivability, not before then. The guide indicates at 85 with 350AAs you have some options. If you're concerned with survivability, go with the Tap-Tank path.
Some folks are perfectly comfortable with their lvl of survivability and so they choose to focus on utility or spike DPS.

With healer mercs or being in groups in general, the concern about survivability is fairly situational. If you're always in a group with a healer, merc or otherwise, its likely you have no concern about staying alive. If you raid, the Utility might be more important or the spike DPS. If you solo one of the other paths might be better. And ofcorse at that level is harder to argue which AA is more important so it becomes more subjective.

In summary, if your lvl 85 necro with 350AAs has followed the path properly he should DPS as well as any other equally equiped necro. As DPS is our primary role, this is all we can ask for. The rest is up to personal preference. I tried to organize the paths in a top-down most useful for that path approach so you know,for example, to get agility before stability, but I'm not going to say that Agility is any better or more useful then Wake the dead. I Will say that critical affliction is better then expansive mind and thats why the guide is written like it is.


P.S. the guide hasn't been updated for UF yet but I'll get around to that soon. I've just been a bit bogged down with stuff and ofcorse, I wait for the populace at large to weigh in on the AAs. Clearly Death Bloom is a must have and a driving force behind getting to lvl 85

[Noobieguy]

10 an hour without lesson? Will have to play around and see what I can do, obviously I have fewer AAs, and 50-60% Focus vs. your 80%, so mine will be a little lower :p

This guide is a very very good start, I just started playing a necro 5 months ago (took 19 or so months off), and I was totally clueless on the class specific AAs. Some great info on here :)

[solithan]

10 an hour without lesson? :)

Crazy eh?

Check this thread
http://www.necrotalk.com/showthread.php?t=10034

People quote lesson burns so they get 50% more xp but its only 30mins not an hr, so if they say 18AA lesson burn thats 18AA/HR if they can keep it up the entire time.

[Vanlor]

It has already been mostly said but, the main reason for not stopping and aa'ing like crazy for most people is because we are primarily a dps class. Aside from dot crits and overcrits the next best way to improve your dps is to level for higher dps spells and higher foci gear. Stopping and capping aas like regen and pet stuff is almost pointless due to returns.

Your necro buddy that you say had trouble on the path to crystallos is likely also not an overly experienced (or talented) player. Most necros hit 85 for the spells and gear only stopping to max their most important dps and utility aas. People that play that way just have to be a little more careful when they kite or group to not get hit. We are a silk class, so we shouldn't be getting ourselves hit super often, anyway.

AAs no longer come slow at any level--especially since they made the exp more linear per level quite some time ago (ie, no super super sweet spots). The people mentioning 10+ aa lotd burns at lvl 85(equivalent of a 10+ aa/hr non-lotd) aren't just bs'ing either.

I, personally, wouldn't consider for a heartbeat doing anything but getting essential utility and high dps aas if I were to re-roll a necro again on my path to lvl 85--especially since some very very important aas don't open up until higher lvls (death bloom) that will drastically increase your AA/hr amount.

[Galkharasi]

I can completely see the validity in the guide being a pure DPS list and having over 1400 AA past its recommendations already I know I'd survive better than some at 85. I suppose a new question would be, do you all see a couple AA like Death Bloom and whatnot as so powerful, so important, that I may want to reconsider sticking at 80 for now?

My pet swarms aren't maxed but they all were at 75, all pet lines were maxed at 75. I saw a noticeable difference in pet DPS output at 65-70 soloing in DSH between no pet lines or swarms, and getting all of them. Mobs were dying far faster since all the pet improvement lines seem to boost the swarms too. . . Also, if not for my swarms and Gathering Dusk I couldn't have Life burned Zordak Ragefire for a guildie's 2.0 shield a few nights ago. All the little "negligible" DPS lines that get scoffed at so often have allowed me to survive a battle at 1-3% HP or squeak out the kill when everyone else is wiped.

My guild is still raiding CoA for epics though we can't take Vangl or OMM for the BP clickies. We can't get the numbers for even TSS. I'm already one of the strongest in the guild despite not being 85 so I'd be stepping that much beyond content anyone else in guild is taking and locking out 65-69 toons from most tasks I'm in. (and thus getting pestered not for groups, but tag-alongs more often.) Considering the limitations of this guild, I won't be seeing T5 essences for a while, much less anything dropped in Underfoot no matter what my level. I'll be mostly devoid of 85 gear without buying it. Also don't have the factions for the spells yet. . . working FoS. And despite its general weakness, I like the people of this guild.

Are a few AA enough to shoot for 85 despite not having faction for spells or groups for gear? When my paladin went to 85 before I retired him it was a complete pita being in SoD with no SoD spells.

((Btw, don't mean to come across as an absolutionist. I'm always looking for alternative mindsets to consider so I can weigh my options))

[Zeli]

I can completely see the validity in the guide being a pure DPS list and having over 1400 AA past its recommendations already I know I'd survive better than some at 85. I suppose a new question would be, do you all see a couple AA like Death Bloom and whatnot as so powerful, so important, that I may want to reconsider sticking at 80 for now?

Good lord yes. At 1400 you're well into the diminishing returns for AAs, especially at 80.

In terms of outgrowing your guild and friends...that's a personal choice. That's an option only you can weigh.

I don't think the faction for spells will be a hinderance for you. You already said you have done the OGH and Kith collection arcs, right? I'd think you have a pretty good head start on the faction grind, and you seem like the type to have the mindset to get things done. With a bit of strategy and perhaps luck, you can also farm your own T3 essences as well...

[Noobieguy]

Faction for all of the SoD zones isn't bad for Necros. I did most of my factioning for all the zones solo by finding tasks I couldl solo. Bloodfields was the toughest, and we did do a few grinds there with my guild and 1 short grind with a good group there. I had ally in Kith around 82, Tosk by 84, and the rest (Bloodfields, FoS, OGH) at 85. Just find tasks you can solo, and repeat them. Not sure what AAs you have, but at 1400 that is a lot more than me (960 ish). I have all dot crits maxxed, just got 3rd spire maxxed, and a decent mix of lot of others. The 85 spells are a very nice boost, even the rk 1s are a big boost over the pre 85 spells (best fire dot we get, plus the 2 best poison dots we get).

If you are 80, and have already finished the OGH and Kith tasks for Void C access, getting faction for most of the zones will not be that hard for you. Just start with the easier ones (Ktih, OGH, FOS) first.

[solithan]

Zeli is quite right. You REALLY need to get to 85. The AAs alone are worth it, not to mention the spells and gear that level unlocks. The spells are buyable as are some serious gear upgrades via silver tokens if not just doing the omm and boomerang missions.

You should certainly persue your epic drop in CoA but the gear there should rot for you.

Personally it sounds like you've way outgrown your current guild but sometimes its comforting to be the big fish in the little pond. Its clearly up to you and any sacrifices you make to maintain your choice is par for the corse.

But yes most resoundly the consensus of the boards here will be for you to move on to lvl 85.

Remember the guide was put together based on the majority opinion of all the existing necro here and based on it, you should have moved on up already and you should certainly do it now. That said, it while it is the majority opinion there are still a select few that like to play out every level and max out all AAs but they undertand they are doing it suboptimally based on a personal choice.

[solithan]

I took a few mins to do some basic updating. It should be more current. I'll need to go back in and double check rank costs for final numbers and to make sure I didn't miss anything but it shouldn't be too far off.

[Vanlor]

Galk,

I understand that you are a returning player and fairly new to this community. There are a number of issues within the class on specifics that people disagree on. However, there are also a number of ideologies that are fairly resoundingly accepted. Ideas that, if you really want to become a truly powerful necromancer you will have to accept. Once you accept them and see them in action, they will make much more sense.

First. Use logic. Weigh in benefits. Calculate dps gained from one path vs. another (or save time and find it somewhere on these boards). STOP AAing and level!!! I didn't start buying pet swarms until after level 85 and well over 2k aas. I still don't have all of them... They are situational and mostly minimal dps for the amount of aa required to get to that dps.

The amount of dps gained by new dots is phenomenal. Not to mention being able to buy aas for new spell slots, more dot crit aas opening, and death bloom (yes, it warrants mentioning alone).

Regen AAs: don't even consider buying mana regen aas for a long time. Death Bloom will cure 95% of all your mana problems. hp regen aas still have some worth, but well well after all main dps, utility, and survivability aas.

Pet offensive AAs: your pet is a pathetically small amount of dps when compared to your dps as a whole and he requires a massive amount of aa work to get to that level. He amounts to (literally) a free mid-range dps dot when totally decked out in aas.

I would highly consider joining a larger family guild with a higher average level if I were you. Unless you have seriously valuable RL friends or really close on-line friends in your current guild, get out now. I had to make a similar decision when I was leveling up for the first time. I was stuck in a progression guild that capped level for the participants. I wanted something greater, I had to move on. Just because you leave doesn't mean you can't remain friends with guild members.

I really could go on (for quite some time). You will find some tough love here at times. You will get used to it. All I can say is, read the boards a lot. Many of these issues have been addressed multiple times and have fairly sound conclusions based on good logic.

[Galkharasi]

I am ruled by logic, caused me a few relationship issues in the past due not "feeling" enough or being affected by situations which, as logic stood, I could not influence so why let them bother me? *shrug*

I've been seriously debating the 85 grind the last couple of days. There are some new people in the guild, I have a few friends who had been in UF raid guilds, my guild isn't completely hopeless it's just hard to get some of them to move on because they haven't explored what they leveled past.

We got someone with an 81 cleric out of guild who had lost interest until my roommate and I came along, and an 85 cleric main just joined within the week. both of them came on a trip to AG to try dropping augs. (got the Frozen Diamond of Purification earlier with my roommate in FC, that helped some) Our leader is an 83 shaman and he's not terrible, but until my roommate and I came along, leveled, AA'ed, and started pumping out some newer content he wasn't doing that much past OoW or GoD because he helps the lower members a lot. Recently got an ex-raid 85 bard, ex-raid 85 paladin, etc. We're looking at assembling a good set of options for a good group, but personal interests and play times do interfere somewhat.

I'm not too concerned regarding the faction in OGH and Kith because I've run most of OGH progression twice and all of the Bayle's Crest (multiple times on some tasks, for the chronos). I also ran all of Kith progression twice and most of it 3-4 times, and completed my Blood of the Fallen. Shouldn't be too much more hunting in there. FoS I'm not even indifferent yet but I was reading about it being a good AA spot so maybe I'll check what level I need for spells there and grind there to level if it's 82-83. Tosk I'm Amiable or Kindly, I hunt ogres in group with my roommate who hunts pigs, but we do it relaxed, not full burn. He's usually there for hours so he'd be burnt out on EQ if all he did was full burn pigs. As for Kuua and Korafax, ain't doing it until I can get a solid group and make sure all of them are big enough to get through Tosk progression so I can make my T5 armor. I need so many clickies it's not even funny.

(On that note, why does nobody mention the DoN clicky? Is it just not worth having? share a cooldown with a better one?)

I'm getting a few of the new AA like the Whisperwind cooldown line (have the first rank) but might level once I hit 1800. (20 away from it.) I didn't say I had 1400, said I had 1400 more than the guide here says to have, sorry if I was unclear. :p I'd love to get silver tokens but the only person I MIGHT talk into doing boomerangs is my roommate and he despises them with a "lose interest in EQ for the day" passion. . . it makes no sense to me as I detest them as well, but KNOW I have to get them out of the way to get what I need for now. . . Logic prevails, feelings are confusing. *shrug* Moving on. . .

I don't need to worry about T3 essences since I'm on FV, bought mine in the bazaar and I'm full T4 already. I have one fractured eternal that an ex-raider friend gave me, but he lost his connections to the group that was able to farm them when he lost the guild tag. As for T3 and T4, my roommate and I duo'ed Vessa last week, using mercs and my weak little 70 shaman bot running on the laptop in his room. (I can't box, but have a second account that he boxes poorly) Eternals are another matter. He also died once on Vessa, so it's kind of hit and miss running those without a full group, not taking T5 yet.

I weigh my options frequently and, if the content I'm taking gets the crap kicked out of me, I go work defenses more before spending too much time there. (golems and oozes on the path to Crystallos) Since I've finally maxed my factions in SoF, except for Camp Valor, I only have flagging to do there. . . It would be nice to not have to farm all my Rk. II spells like in SoF, such as my lich. *mutters imprecations on whoever decided to make it drop in Crystallos and Zeka*

I've not worked any pet lines since 75 but since I can send 19 pets on a single mob (varying 3-10 minute cooldowns) I can put out easily 20% more damage over the course of one AG mob than just using a round of dots. Mind you I only use 6 at a time because I don't have Death Bloom or multiple regen boosts like druidskin and a good clicky. Not saying Max spells, then pets, but since I DID and I'm not on Test, no going back now. I'll save catching up on pet lines until I have all the important 81-85 stuff though. Have spell crits maxed again, 1 rank left on Theft of Life, 1 rank left on Hastened Whisperwind.

I save my clerics a lot of mana by ordering them to leave me injured, heh. Also save my tanks a death due to some retard cleric with an itchy heal finger swapping targets on a big named. . . FD, get up, tap, repeat until healthy. Burns out some mana, but saves the tank. (if not an issue I save my own mana) Not just working ToL for the clerics though, I solo a LOT and may have finally found a few people who could get a good force together and obtain that ToB clicky for free heals. Also found out about the ToB AE reduction tasks so I may use those as honey to draw them in to aid if asking is not enough. . .

Alright, I'm going to grind out my last few AA (personal OCD prerogative) and level to 85. Recommend any lines being picked up on the way to speed killing? (aside from the obvious crit lines)

[Zeli]

Long post. Alot to digest there...



(On that note, why does nobody mention the DoN clicky? Is it just not worth having? share a cooldown with a better one?)

The lifetap click is underwhelming, and the difficulty of Vish even to this day (let alone farming faction) is why no one mentions it.

You've mentioned clickies several times and aside from the OoW robe...they are all fluff. I got them when I was bored or burnt out on AAing for the moment. They are hardly game-changing.

It would be nice to not have to farm all my Rk. II spells like in SoF, such as my lich. *mutters imprecations on whoever decided to make it drop in Crystallos and Zeka*

Which, if you levelled, you'd be replacing anyways. The DoTs and some others are still useful, don't get me wrong...but for most (and you'll notice a theme here) the diminishing returns do not make the farm worthwhile.

Unless you're OCD. :D

[solithan]

Sounds like you have a lot of conflicting factions going on, OCD and guild ties.
Thats all well and good but you'll have to accept you're on and have been on "the slow path". I'm certain you've wasted a lot of time picking up AAs that are not as powerful as other AAs you could have picked up and none of which are as powerful as spells you could have picked up at 85 or gear at 85.

You don't have to go on boomerange missions to get silver tokens, I've never done a single one and I have over 1k silver tokens, I just buy them in the bazaar. I don't know what your server market is like but mine has tons of them.

Old Man Mckenzie missions(omm) has way way way better gear then anything your guild can raid, you could convience your guild to do the OMM raids and drop the CoA/GoD/whatever else lowbie stuff. They should focus on those for gear and make leveling groups to get to 85. Once everyone is leveled up and geared up then you can try out some content.

Seriously, why waste time getting 250/250 hp mana stuff when you can get 600/600+ stuff. Now, if you prefer not to skip content, thats all fine and well and good but please see "the slow path". :)

If you want to be on the fast track, set xp to 100%regular and let us know when you hit 85.

[Zeli]

You don't have to go on boomerange missions to get silver tokens, I've never done a single one and I have over 1k silver tokens, I just buy them in the bazaar. I don't know what your server market is like but mine has tons of them.

And now the UF missions will also have silver tokens as a reward.

[Soulcrates]

My honest recomendation is this, play the game how you want to play it, and let all other opinions fall away.

Some people in this game let guilds and ego's run them, and then wonder why there alwasy upset, and disappointed by whats happening to them in game. A friend of mine just had this happen to him, and he is all tore up about the guild remving him. I asked him point blank, who is really playing your character? you or them?

If your happy in your guild, be happy with it, and do what your doing. It makes no sense to compare one necro to another, all your doing is looking for a way to upset yourself. Dont let the worlds opinion run you, or you will be at there will, and that will is as fickle as the breeze. One day your the man, the next day your a zero, who wants to live that way? Especially in a online game enviorment?

I have been there, raid guilds, striving to do things etc. All it led to was me quitting for along time. Now me and a shaman friend play for fun and i have had the best time since. No pressure, we do alot of quests, we improve where we can, and outside of that, it is what it is. A fun game to play.

The journey is the key, enjoy it. And yes i am a Zen Budhist, its takin me many years to learn to enjoy the process.

[Zeli]

My honest recomendation is this, play the game how you want to play it, and let all other opinions fall away.

Well said.

[Noobieguy]

My honest recomendation is this, play the game how you want to play it, and let all other opinions fall away.

Some people in this game let guilds and ego's run them, and then wonder why there alwasy upset, and disappointed by whats happening to them in game. A friend of mine just had this happen to him, and he is all tore up about the guild remving him. I asked him point blank, who is really playing your character? you or them?

If your happy in your guild, be happy with it, and do what your doing. It makes no sense to compare one necro to another, all your doing is looking for a way to upset yourself. Dont let the worlds opinion run you, or you will be at there will, and that will is as fickle as the breeze. One day your the man, the next day your a zero, who wants to live that way? Especially in a online game enviorment?

I have been there, raid guilds, striving to do things etc. All it led to was me quitting for along time. Now me and a shaman friend play for fun and i have had the best time since. No pressure, we do alot of quests, we improve where we can, and outside of that, it is what it is. A fun game to play.

The journey is the key, enjoy it.

I agree, play how you WANT to play and that is fun for you. The advice / opinions here are for what would be "BEST" if you want to improve your DPS and be able to take on tougher things and more content. I have to say, having just hit 85 2 weeks ago, the spells and maxing out destructive cascade, has been a big boost for me :) Friend of mine the other day said, wow, you have really improved your DPS, which made me feel good :p This game is all about having fun, whether it be taking on the toughest mob you can, helping others accomplish things, or just running around doing quests and getting faction (BLEH, so sick of factioning! LOL).

[Vanlor]

The lifetap click is underwhelming, and the difficulty of Vish even to this day (let alone farming faction) is why no one mentions it.

You've mentioned clickies several times and aside from the OoW robe...they are all fluff. I got them when I was bored or burnt out on AAing for the moment. They are hardly game-changing.

Also, the DoN clicky does share a lockout timer with the ToB clicky. If you look at my profile, I do have both the DoD and the ToB clicky, but I don't use either all that often any more. When you hit 85, get some decent foci, and get your spells, you will understand what we are talking about with the clickies making a minimal difference (with the exception of OoW robe). Really... clickies should be an afterthought...



Which, if you levelled, you'd be replacing anyways. The DoTs and some others are still useful, don't get me wrong...but for most (and you'll notice a theme here) the diminishing returns do not make the farm worthwhile.

Unless you're OCD. :D

This. Many of those SoF spells (you mentioned lich rk 2 for example) will be replaced by higher level ones. There isn't much reason to spend a lot of time/pp farming the lower version's rk 2 when you will soon replace it.


If you plan to stay with this guild and help/make them grow, the best path is to try to get them to focus on newer content (unless they don't want to skip progression). They should really start out in SoD. There are many areas in SoD where 75-80s can do quite well. Get them geared up on essences and then progress through the tiers of SoD. All content before that really becomes trivial. That raid gear that you are farming in CoA doesn't even compare to the group gear of SoD+.

You will be shocked by your power gains from lvl 80 to lvl 85. You will be able to help a lot of your lower lvl guildies even more etc. As a random example, I am confident that I can molo the named in Tosk without a problem with the gear/aas that I have. I am quite a bit ahead of you in gear, lvl, and aas, but I think you get the point...

[Galkharasi]

Don't know why people keep saying I'll get good gear at 85, or why they assume "we farm CoA for epics" means we farm it for gear. We don't raid, only go after epics. I can fill a group pretty easily in this guild when I look for it, but not everyone can. Many like to run about boxing and using mercs, don't talk much, but are great when they do. When people are talkative nearly all of them are amusing to interact with and fun to spend time with. More of the people joining lately are definitely better at grouping and active participation but this truly is a family style guild.

As things stand we have maybe 2 people who can tank anything that will result in 85 gear. One is being deployed within a few weeks and the other is rarely on. Some months from now my roommate will be able to again, but he isn't a necromancer. His class requires a ton of AA to survive. At that point we'll be able to arrange groups to get some of it. Other than that I'd need some examples of places and methods for acquiring it without aid. Nearly everything I have I've had to obtain myself and I consider that a mark of pride, actually doing it.

I am leveling to 85, nearly 80% into 80 right now but helping a new guildmate on his 2.0 so that'll push back the XP gain a little. (not CoA help, something in OoT.) I'm leveling because the mana issue wasn't much of a problem until I started grouping with more burst DPS classes and finally started being the one who needed to med first. Now I can completely see the validity of getting Death Bloom instead of thinking "that'll be nice when the time comes".

I do play the game to have fun but I've seen many of the other grouping guilds here and quite a few of our members came from them dissatisfied. I've been a raider, fack that. I don't have the time or, more importantly, the inclination to turn EQ into a job that requires I pay it in order to have the tools needed to keep doing what I'm required to do to keep the job. As long as I'm a grouper and mostly solo necromancer, I'll stick with the most enjoyable family guild I know of.

Vishimtar is a pain, I completely agree. With an allied guild we've attempted him 3 times because we like killing dragons. Faction isn't an issue. I can advance one full step in a day with my roommate and that was at 75. Have everything completed except Vishimtar, whose eye will permit me to obtain the clicky. As has been mentioned, most clickies are fluff. I rarely use any but my pet clickies and then only on burning named. Once I have Death Bloom I may retire those as I can keep doing more costly dots instead. (keeping my TSS group clicky for when pet is tanking)

Like I said, I'm leveling to 85 for the AA and spells and will EVENTUALLY get the gear but am not expecting it so not anticipating its effects. Any advice on AA to pick up (other than spell DPS lines) which may help soloability would be appreciated, as would learning places to farm SoD faction/XP. All my previous characters have been pretty group reliant and last time I had many people of greater power about. This time I'm mostly self reliant and don't have an issue with that.

Silver tokens I think are running 4-5k a piece on our server. This has the WORST bazaar prices I've ever seen because so much normally no-trade stuff is tradeable here. I might make 5-7k in a day where I hunt, best was 15k. 3 tokens a day vs the 43 I got in one boomerang, I'd rather pay someone 10k to run a boomerang with me. As for the CMM rewards, I've been in 2 group tasks and one raid before they required Crystallos completion to get any raid rewards (*expletive deleted*tards). Once I get to 85 I can finally run them just by having my roommate in group and boxing the alt. Definitely want the tash click. Even when we have enchanters along I usually have to ASK for tash on named. Never understood that. . .

[solithan]

You should run old man mckinezie missions. They are monster missions so you current gear is irrelevant. You can get nice nice gear there AND you can level up very fast as the missions have excellent XP.

Your bazaar sounds jacked up, forget that.

As for AAs i'm pretty sure you just need to set xp to 100% normal. I'm sure you've got enough until you hit 85. But if in doubt, consult the guide. If you have everything it lists before 85 then you know what your goal is, if not the guide tells you.

But like everyone has said, and the guide says, if you have fun playing the game the way you do, then just do it :) But if you're here looking for advice then go for it.

[solithan]

Ok I'm starting the update for this new set of AAs and levels. Unlike in past years there is nothing game changing at 90 that you should press to 90 ignoring all else. We do however get some much needed new nice AAs along the way so stop and pick them up.

Also as expected its easier to get XP at 85 then 86 so bank some AAs before doing so. Here is my suggested guide/outline for leveling up and picking up needed AAs along the way. I'll come back and tweak the %s once I'm certain they get you the predicted amounts.

Stay 85 and bank 30AAs then spend them like this.

Death's Effigy - 12
Pestilent paralysis -9
Hastend encroaching darkness -7

Then,
---Ding 86---
(Claim X10 banked quest rewards)
Available at lvl 86 (92)

Then buy,
Lingering Death - 12

---grind---(50/50 mix until all 92 done)
**If mana is an issue get these first
**Spell Casting Mastery - 9
**Gift of mana - 9
vengeful spirits - 9
twincast - 7
Expanding darkness - 7
reluctant benevolance - 12
scent of terris - 6
Shield Block - 9
theft of life Rank1 - 12

---Ding---(switch to 80/20)
Just banks AAs

---Ding---(switch to 80/20)
Available at lvl 88 (36)

vengeful spirits - 12
Lingering Death - 12
reluctant benevolance - 12


---Ding---(switch to 80/20)
Available at lvl 89 (28)

pestilent paralysis - 9
Hastend encroaching darkness - 7

---Ding---
Available at lvl 90 (110 )

Improved Death Peace - 12
vengeful spirits - 12
Lingering Death - 12
mercurial torment - 15
Embalmer's carapace - 12
Aegis of Kildrukaun - 12
Shield Block - 11

rise of bones rank1,2,3 - 8,8,8