AA progression

[Rikam]

Alright lvl 65 have 14aa they are in run3 regen3 scm2 and theft of life1. Was wondering what would be the best route to take I solo and make kite grps and am a hardcore raider. So far I was thinking finish up scm3 and get pet disc then after that wasn't really sure. Thanx for your help and I am sure I'll get flamed but I looked for another topic like this couldn't find it. If you know where the topic is post it instead of just calling me a big silly stupid head or whatever you kids say now a days.

[Jebasiz]

For a raiding necromancer, scm3 is very important. Critical affliction and Fury of Magic will help tons too. Theft of life isn't bad...but I'd probably go with aa's to increase your overall dps before going for other things. (Note: I'd advise a bit different if you weren't raiding) Resist AA's aren't a bad idea either depending on what expansion your fighting in. ...

[Vaelhan]

yeah yeah i know , i been gone too long. /wave jeb and all meh other peoples.

I agree with jeb as to the resists being a good option and scm is very useful to.
but i wouldn't get your crit affliction just yet since you raid hardcore, its ok for people like jeb who have tanks that can hold agro but if you don't have a very well equipped tank your sure to grab agro on every mob wich is not good.
Personally i'd go for scm3 your hp aa's ie ND3 and innate sta abilities, and abilities that make you more efficent instead of more powerful, no use having all this dps if 1 you don't have the mana to keep it up or 2 get agro and die all the time, yes its great for solo but can really land you into a world of shite if you do too much dmg.


Vaelhan Hemafier - 65 arch lich - Tunare

[Rikam]

Well, I am pretty descent on agro management I fd often on raids sometimes every other dot/nuero. As for manna I have 4k not sure if thats great but I think its pretty descent. I am already at 200 sta though so not sure sta aa will help much less innates yield more hp then gear/spell sta does. ND3 I will be getting but been more worried about getting the ones that will help with dmg alrdy at 2600 hp so 260 from nd will be nice but not somthing I have to have atm i think. Thanks for suggestions.

[Goshozal Sans Merci]

Provided that you have SoS, it should be really hard to run out of mana on most raid encounters. At the very least, it provides you plenty of mana to repeatedly FD with to keep your aggro down.

It really comes down to what you want the most - there are plenty of AA that increase your "burst" dps, allowing you to do more damage in a short amount of time, and plenty of AA that increase your overall dps but may not act instantly.

Personally, I prefer overall dps, as I don't think that I add much to your typical trash-clearing session on a raid with my whopping 1300 nuke. So after SCM3 I took pet discipline, crit affliction, WTD, pet swarm, and I'm working on pet flurry. After flurry, I'll be moving on to the crit-nuke AA's and finally to resists.

One AA that I do definitely recommend for a raider is lifeburn. It's just a really, really nice thing to have around. I'm not as jacked-up as Jebasiz is, but I still pull 5600 or so hp raid-buffed. That's a nice amount of hurting to put on a boss mob for no mana cost whatsoever.

[Rikam]

Ahh my other question lol. How does manna burn work not sure on the exact dmg/life it takes is it 1dmg per 1hp or is it like mannaburn. Thanks couldn't quite understand it from the explanation. Also, do you think that suspended minion is worth it? Can you invis with a pet suspended and can you suspend a dc pet?

[Jebasiz]

Lifeburn is nice...I use it soloing alot too while kiting. In ldon when you that "persistent healer" it's a good "threshold breaker" ( the point where a mob knows it's gonna die and stops healing) There's lots of applications to lots of aa's, as a raiding necro though, your primary role on a raid is to sustain high amounts of dps. In elemental planes there are several encounters with mobs that steal life and mana, and tons that have damagine AE's where your group will need zevfeers, casting zevfeers 3-4 times on babnoxious the spiderqueen will hurt your mana pool without scm3, and ofassaa the enlightened....well, heh yeah, good luck buddy.

[Goshozal Sans Merci]

Lifeburn does damage equal to your current total hp. If you have 5000 hp, it does 5000 direct damage. It also drops your hp to roughly 20%, so the mob will take a bunch of damage and you will too. The last thing it does is put a dot on the mob that heals you over time - the dmg to the mob is 200 or 250/tic (I can't remember), and you get healed roughly at the rate of saryrn's kiss for a few tics. I think it's 6 or 7 tics. What I typically do is cast lifeburn, tap once or twice, and I'm fine.

Yes, you can invis while a pet is suspended. I don't have the AA myself, but it seems nice. No, you cannot suspend a dc pet - only a pet that you have summoned.

[Jebasiz]

I cast saryrn's kiss right before lifeburn...

[Recluse]

I really just don't get lifeburn. Quite a few raiding necros I've talked to swear by it but to me it seems like the aa's would be better spent in crit dd's. Lifeburn would rock -if the reuse time wasn't almost 3 hours. I can get a lot of damage out of my crits in those two hours and 44 minutes.


The other problem I would have would be knowing when to use it for my guild. We do at least 3 targets a night, if not more. Hell, tonight we did seven. I'd hate to use the bloody thing on AL in Ssra only to have RZtW called as our next target.

[Demetrii Spiritdrinker]

Worried about not contributing DPS to RZtW? Word of Terris, sir. :P

[Vaelhan]

DPS is good and all, but even an average necro with no dot crit aa's can put out 350 dps on any given mob , and it may not seem like it but 350 dps is actually very high. it ranks many necros in the top 3 dps classes. personally i know a ew necros who put out 500-600 dps but even as far as melee goes i don't know that many people who out dps me or ne other necro i know. There are necros who ks entire groups on tunare server, i've done it on a few occasions in BoT just goofing off helping a friend with a mini or somethin so DPS really isn't that much of a problem, again i've rolled for the efficency more then the pure beat down method of aa purchase. There's plenty of time to work on your offensive skills ( and i guess defensive to ) but being a defensive minded player its just the way i think.
Either way it doesn't really matter what me or jeb or anyone else says about where we put our aa's or where we should put them because there is no wrong decision. The best way for you to learn and enjoy the work you put into getting aa's is to experiment with them, put a lil here put a lil there and see what you like best. Everyone has a different way of playing thier toons. /rant off :ph34r:


Vaelhan Hemafier - 65 arch lich - Tunare

[Goshozal Sans Merci]

Lifeburn, despite its reuse timer, is essentially free damage. When you're raid buffed, it's LOTS of free damage. Not only does it give you a huge burst in DPS, but the sustained extra 250/tic it does is nothing to sniff at.

There's just no reason to turn it down. It doesn't really *matter* what you use it on, it's a massive burst of damage for zero mana.

[Jebasiz]

personally I like my single cast cast 9700 mana free dmg lifeburn alot. Due to it's unresistable nature (or damn close) sometimes it's the only thing that lands during parts of fights. As to which target to use it on. Well if your guild is killing RZtW and in ssra...The ssra part of your night shouldn't be too challenging so I'd save it for the close fights. On Time raids, I save mine for Rallos Zek, since caster dps is lowest for him...due to insane resists at the end of the fight. In gates...well, Where ever we got to and whiped yesterday...I use it there the next day, heh. You know what your guild can handle, and handle well...if something goes wrong and the outcome of the fight is questionable...let it fly.

[Recluse]

I'm still not seeing it -yes, it's 10k of mana free damage (pending you have timeless gear like Jeb:) but why would SoD be a less viabel option for burst dps? From what I've heard each archer does around 2-3k worth of damage. With the aa maxed out the archers' over all damage would be close to that of LB. In addition, the reuse time on SoD is half an hour. You could almost get 6 SoD's in in the time you could cast one LB. For me the damage would probably be higher on SoD than LB as I only have 4.7k hp's in full raid.


I mean, don't get me wrong, I do want lifeburn and it's something I will get -eventually. I just don't see the essentialness of it that most necros do. It's a dps burst much like WTD and SoD and has it's place but I'm more concerned with improving my over all dps first and foremost before I focus on my burst damage.


In addition, LB is an aa i really feel SOE needs to upgrade. Seriously, for the damage it will do for the average necro a two hour and forty-four minute reuse time is steep. We should either get aa's with the next expansion that increase it's damage or (even better) lower the reuse time. I don't see how allowing us to use LB every half hour would be to unreasonable.

[Rikam]

SoD 30 aa life burn 9 aa......... yeah may help and faster reuse but theres a big difference there lol.) Other then that I would agree lifeburn timer needs to be shorter or let it crit with scf or something. about to join a ele guild so think I will be doing lifeburn cause my HP might actualy look good then). Thanks for all the help and suggestions all think it really helped put it in perspective.

[Jebasiz]

In luclin before they nerfed it, some fights lasted over half an hour.... I don't think they're gonna change it, cuz then they'd have to change mana burn and ht too. PC's are providing enough dps as-is the way the encounters are designed, and WAAAYYY to much content is trivial already. It's a great aa if your raiding, and I think you'll see that when you use it a few times.

[ssyruk]

I have question regarding aa progression. I have recently made 54 and already have run3 and regen3. I also have an extra point just floatin out there. I know SCM is next but where do I go from there? I am in a small guild and we havent graduated to hard core raiding yet. The biggest thing we've done to date is make it thru 3 wings in HS (would have went all the way but the cleric went LD and never came back). Anyhoo, with so many cool aa's i just don't know where to spend the points. Thanx in advance

[Jebasiz]

At 60 and even minimal aa, you can solo all of HS...If your in a small guild I'd suggest you level to 60-65 and not aa at all. It's the "doing more with less" thing.
Also to get spell casting mastery, you need 12 aa total..so when ya get all 3 maybe move onto something else. Level, gear and playstyle fluactuate so greatly it's hard to say what you'll need then. Your biggest upgrades atm though are levels and filling out your spell book, not through alternate advancement or gear.

[ssyruk]

Thanx Jeb...I think I'll do just that. The only reason I have as many aa's as I do is cause I was holding out for a dragon raid :P .

[Rikam]

Don't ask me why or how but with theft of life you can crit pet heals. Bought the first lvl just so I could tap more efficiently and went to seb pet tanking crit heal almost fell on the floor. 2k pet heal roxors) lol. SCF 1 sucks so yeah kick it in the nuts 300+ dd casted 1 crit so far). Hoping two will be better.