roles in raids

[Jebasiz]

Basically it's to prevent, http://www.gucomics.com/archives/view.php?cdate=20000920

I mean someone's gotta kill stuff, right?

[Draz]

:P :D

[Recluse]

Lol, I was actually just about to post a new raid thread of my own when I saw this.


I think there have already been enough posts on what a necro's role in a raid is for newcomers to figure out. If not, here's a recap: You damage, twitcihng is bs.


Anyway, I'd been interested to know what you yourselves and your guild does for certain mobs (what tactics are employed, where do you postion yourself, what spells land, etc.)


I'll start. Presently my guild is flagging for HoH B so we can do MM. Tonight we did AD and the villagers and nomads trials. I won't waste my time with the HoH trials -the only one of any real merit is RD. AD is interesting fight though. So here we go:


Aerin 'Dar -Plane of Valor


This crystal dragon has one of the most annoying AoE's I've encountered in a raid so far: fear. Against most raid mobs fear in and of itself is more of an annoyance. It can constantly interupt your casting if you're not careful. However, AD also has a nasty AoE dd/dot that can drop your hit points very fast if you're not careful. The first time I ever fought her I was feared instantly and began mcving toward her. The entire time I kept getting hit with the AoE, which dropped my hp's by about 10% per round. By the time i regained control of myself I was right by the dragon and at about 20% health. I frantically tried to move back but the AoE made short work of me.


My tips:

-Make friends with a bard. Hell, if you can have one in your group and auto follow them. If you're not sure of where to find one, head toward the clerics. I'm postive they'll have a bard playing magic resits songs by their camp. This will help you tremendously in avoiding Aerin's AoE's.

-If you get feared, sit down. You'll stop running and thusly will more likely than not be able to get away from her AoE's

-If you're on kite duty, try to stay along the walls (unless the clerics are parked close to them). Threre's nothing worse than kiting 3 or so mobs and be feared by AD.

-Use SK and ToM heavily. Usually after I load my dots I just chain tap this bitch. Very useful for keep your hp's at a safe margin. Don't worry to much about getting summoned by her for the tapping either. If you're like me and don't totally have the MR's to with stand her AoE's, then unload on her. Unless your raid force is really good, her AoE will get you eventually, so you'd better go down fighting.

-Have and extended range item if possible. I myself do not but with one you can usually cast on her out of range of her AoE's


Spells that work:

-FPoK
-Horror
-BoT
-SK
-Neuro
-ToM

Pretty much everything seems to stick on her. Her resists are very low.


ANyway, I hope that helps

[Jebasiz]

Wait til you fight http://eqbeastiary.allakhazam.com/search.shtml?id=11299 the first time, hehe.

[Recluse]

Now you got me scared Jeb lol


Anyway, hopefully we'll be doing RZtW tonight if he's still up. Stay posted for reflections from the latest wipe lol

[Recluse]

Lord Mithrial Marr -Temple of Marr


Guild finally bagged him on fourth attempt. Had three failed yesterday and got him early this evening on first try. He's an extremely straight forward fight. Infact, the strat is very simular to the AoW. AoW would be a good practice run for Marr. LMM is slowable but the shammy's had to use their diease based slow which only clocks in at 40%. In general he seems to have very high mr's. I got ToM to land but Horror was resisted through out the fight.

Anyway, you corner him into the north or south corner, mez/off tank adds as needed and go to work. Adds shouldn't be an issue. Really you just need to keep the mt(s) alive. My guild doesn't have a true mt so we used an aoe taunt and had each tank step up as their defensive disk ran out. Marr hits extremely hard and fast but otherwise there's not much to him. He has a dd proc that does around 1.3k, but nothing special. Have healers spam the tank(s) and keep him off the dps and you're fine.

You may be called on to twitch this fight if you're clerics aren't good. Mine aren't and I had to drop some mana to them midway. Don't let anyone tell you to primarily focus on twitching though. We tried with the necros in heavy twitch cycles on the first 3 attempts and they were wipes. When we were allowed to focus on damage, it was a win.


My Tips:

-Don't use pets, at least not till SOE works out that damned wall bug. The first time we used pets. They pushed Marr into the wall and he was untargetable untill most of the raid was dead.

-Stay off the squares in LMM's charmber. Previously they had spawned adds by stepping on them or sped up the spawn rate or something. I heard it was nerfed but best not to chance it in imo. The wurlans that spawn in LMM's chamber are all around 67. To many of them can be bad even for a good cc team

-I hate to say this but swallow some pride and twitch the clerics from time to time. They will have to quick heal the mt(s) on this encounter. If they don't have great mana pulls as mine don't, toss them some. However, do not baby them. You want to kill Marr asap. Your damage is crucial. If you don't have the mana, have a pally step into the ch rotation and LoH till you regain some mana or another necro can step in to twitch a lom cleric.

-Don't panic. If you don't have a 12k/300+ aa mt, you'll probably go through a few of them. As long as the back up tanks know what they're doing, no reason to worry when the mt goes down. If it's done right, another will step in and instantly pick up agro while the dead tank will be rezzed and rebuffed for his next go round with LMM.


Spells that work:

-FPoK
-DP
-BoT (sometimes)
-ToM (sometimes)
-SK (sometimes)
-Nuero

In general FPoK seemed to have the lowest resist by far of any of the dots followed by DP. I don't think FPoK was resisted at all. DP I believe got one resist. BoT got a few resists but it's worth recasting for the damage. One round of BoT with crit affliction is some nice dps. I don't have the diease based lt but i imagine it would stick more often than your magic based one. SK isn't really worth bothering with on this fight imo. The resist rate is fairly high and it costs a lot of mana. Stick with ToM though really you shouldn't have to tap much for this encounter. I think I only tapped once. Don't bother with Horror. On our 2nd attempt I spent most of the encounter trying to get it to stick with no luck. Keep DP memmed instead.

[Zikbus Wickbus]

my guild just did a successful raid on Rumblecrush because of my splurt. i was the last person alive, he summoned me and hit me and my splurt killed him in the middle of his round. unfortunately we got ninja looted cause i went LD however ><

[Recluse]

Saryrn -Plane of TORMENT


In ancient Rome there was an emperor known as Nero. I'm sure the name rings a bell. He is lengendary for numerous attrocities. Amongst other things he was an actor of sorts. He wroted, directed and starred in many plays during his rule of Rome. It was required at the penality of death that all uppercrust Rome should attend. These plays were reputadly so bad that members of the audience were known to feign death so that they could be carried from the theater. Others simply suffered the executioner's wrath as they could take no more of Nero.


The Saryrn event is much like this. You're apt to find your mouse arrow resting on the guild remove button without even realizing it during this event. Even if you need the flag or want the loot (there is an awesome ba4 earring that drops off of Saryrn called the Miserable Bauble) you'll be hard pressed to see this one all the way through.


You begin by clearing trash mobs... and clear... and clear... and clear. Occasionally there's a mini in the way. Th most notable one is The Prophet, a dude in a white robe that turns himself into a octupus looking thingie in the middle of the fight. Three hours later you will luckily find yourself in the same room as Saryrn. Pray that your guild can take her out so that you will never have to endure this awful event again.


Saryrn is a gimp. The only really difficult thing about her is Sorrowsong and the numerous other black birds that spawn periodicly through out the fight. They cast Silence on the casters, an annoying effect that prevents you from casting. This can be diasterous if the clerics are not positioned right. I've seen an entire CH rotation shut down before because the clerics were not positioned right.


Otherwise this is a pretty straight forward fight. Have mez/off tank the birds as needed and dot the hell out of Saryrn. She has very low resists. Sorrowsong does not become targetable till Saryrn is at 22% I believe. When it does become targetable, jump on it and wax the bird asap.



My Tips:

-Position yourself on the left hand side of Saryrn's chamber in that slant in the wall pathing (you'll see what i'm talking about when you get there). The clerics should be positioned here as well. The reason why is it doesn't seem like the birds flock to this spot as often. I know I'm rarely silenced here anyway.

-Make friends with a bard. There should be one playing magic resists at spot mentioned in previous tip. Stand next to them.

-Be patient. I don't think there's one person who's done the Saryrn event and enjoyed it. People will be grouchy, tempers will flare. Try not to add to any of it. If it's your first time doing it, try to be grateful to the veterans returning. If it's your 20th time doing Saryrn, try to remember the you were in the shoes of the new recruits at one point and do your best to get this event done so you don't have to do it agian. If your guild leader is doing this for any other reason than back flagging, disband. She has some nice loot, but Jesus does it ever suck. Let her keep it.



Spells that work:

-FPoK
-Horror
-BoT
-SK
-ToM
-Nuero

I'm assuming DP will land as well. She has very low resists. DoT as much as you can. She seems to have a lot of hp's. I know I did around 70k of damage ot her last encounter. This may be due to people being silenced nad unable to cast. Whatever the case, lay it on.

[Recluse]

Innoruuk -Plane of Hate


For some reason I find Inny to be one of the most enjoyable encounters in the game. I think it's because he's a good blend of ease and challenge. I know that's a little confusing... Basically Inny's pretty gimp even after the revamp. He only hits for around 850 and the adds are nothing to write home about. But there are a lot of them. In addition Inny has one of the most truely annoying resists in the game: It's impossible to land a spell on him unless you're within his melee range. Outside of it and your spells will be instantly resisted, every last one of them. This means you have to run right up next to the prince of hate, cast on him and pray you can clear out before he goes on a rampage. This makes for a pretty interesting encounter.


Clearing to Inny is nothing special of note. Just try to stay with the raid because the Plane of Hate is kind of confusing. Inny drops some nice loot for his level of difficulty. I'm kind of suprised more guilds don't use Inny as a farming tool. If you can take him down, you should as much as possible.


My Tips:

-Keep force shield memmed. Inny procs an aoe dispell. Even if you really go all out with junk buffs you're not apt to have much left at the ned of the encounter. It's good to keep force shield up whenever running in to cast on him. The damage it will absorb will more often than not be enough to get you out of his melee range alive

-Stack junk buffs. Yes, he probably will dispell most if not all of oyur buffs in time. But you should make an effort to hold onto your hp buffs as long as possible. I have vampric embrace, grim aura, banshee aura, deadeye, dmf, force shield and inviz cast on myself before mgb's start. Make the bastard work for those dispells.

-Watch for his rampage. I try to slip in twice after he's finished rampaging then go fd.

-Watch the healers. Generally the adds can be mezzed/off-tanked without much fuss. But occasionally one wil lget to your priests. Run in there and start kiting it asap.

-Don't underestimate Inny. Yes, he is a gimp, but things can quickly get ugly if people are not on the ball for him.


Spells that work:

-Horror (sometimes)
-SK (sometimes)
-FPoK
-BoT (sometimes)
-ToM (sometimes)
-Nuero (sometimes)

It's hard for me to tell how bad Inny's resists are. When a spell is resiststed sometimes it's difficult to tell if it's because of his actual resists or because you were out of melee range. I do know that he has fairly high MR's. Most necro's in my guild use the diease based lifetap for this encounter. I don't have it. In general I've found it's a good idea to have SK on Inny at all times. Healers will be busy with the off tanks and ToM has a failrly high resists rate. Try to keep SK on him for those times you get whacked from rampage.

[AnimocityStromm]

Watch for his rampage. I try to slip in twice after he's finished rampaging then go fd.

Try to keep SK on him for those times you get whacked from rampage.

Does Inny have a unique form of rampage? Does he have an AE rampage? If not, there's no reason you should ever be hit with rampage unless 6-10 tanks die first. And if you do get on rampage somehow, FD only takes you off rampage until you stand up again...rampage comes right back to you.

[Recluse]

Anim-


Yes, Inny has aoe rampage. In general you will have your entire raid force ease in to do either land a spell or do some melee damage and then pull back before he rampages. That's one of the more challenging things about Inny: it's difficult to establish a RT.


I didn't mean to imply fd'ing wiped rampage. You are quite right that it doesn't, but it does help a great deal with your agro management:) I guess it's redudant to note such as I'm sure most can guess it's a good idea to fd for a few secs after loading dots.

[Ahura Mazda]

Babs!!! she aint so bad ;)

[Raskk]

Just a quick thought.. but what if Mind Wrack worked on all mobs regardless of wether they had mana or not. You think that would make necros much more desired in guilds of any level? Beastlords are pretty useless in raids imho, except for MGB Paragon once every 15 minutes.. sure ferocity is nice, but definately just some polish. I figure Mind Wrack would sorta be like paragon if it could work on any mob any time.

[Recluse]

No, what would be sweet is if mind wrack was MGB-able like paragon or aoe. You could have your entire raiding necro force wrack at various points in the encounter. It would seriously cut down on the need for twitching and allow us to do something deteremental when feeding the clerics.

[Raskk]

How about both? =D

[Jebasiz]

Most gods, atleast elemental and above you can't mind wrack. They don't have mana but seem to cast constantly /shrug. Maybe a benefit of being a diety...it's messed up but that's the way it is. I do think I got one on xegony, I know fennin has no mana. Anyway...

I've landed Horror on LMM, and yeah he has some decent resists, from the sound of what was posted you either had an incomplete debuff chain, or....they didn't refresh it as it wore off. Any mob of that caliber is gonna resist...but eventually almost anything should land on Mithaniel Marr, Grats on your kill btw.

-FPoK
-DP
-BoT (sometimes)
-ToM (sometimes)
-SK (sometimes)
-Nuero

Add pyrocuor and possibly zevfeers (if you have the mana pool/regen for it)

[Raskk]

When stacking all those dots on a raid mob, are you suppose to FD constantly to lower agro between casts? because with my lowbie necro fighting xp mobs, anymore then 3 dots will cause the mob to ignore my pet and come for me.

[Jebasiz]

Depends on who's tanking, and if they've been tanking the whole fight. Typically I land pyro, sk, horror, fd, stand, bot, night, fpok, fd, lifetap lifetap, horror, repeat.
If the tank dies, fd immediately... and then again within 3-4 rounds and you should be ok.

[Recluse]

Jeb-


I'm holding out till I get the elemntal pants for pryo, don't have the mana for it atm lol.


Honestly though, is zeevfer's that big of a deal in raids. I know you've mentioned it several times as a great spell to keep up for your raiding party but for the mana cost? Obviously I don't have the mana pool atm to cast it but even if I did I can think of other dots to put up rather a measly 80 hp per tick heal. Against mobs that hit for 1.5k or more a pop it seems kinda redudant...


And thanks for the gratz:)


Ras-


That's how you do it when you have a real tank in front of you. This is how you do it when jack and shit are your mt's:

Land DP, FPoK and BoT then fd immediatly. For some reason BoT has really high agro so best to get on the ground as soon as fd pops. Wait about two ticks then get up and cast Horror then go back down. Stay down for about 3-4 ticks then get back up and start renewing dots in the order. Once you get the timing down each should be renewed right as it runs out. Throw SK into the rotation as needed for heals unless you're fighting a mob where you'll constantly be taking damage through AoE's or rampage.

[nethyia]

For mobs with an AE, Zefveer's can be a nice save for your group's healer's mana in a raid. Or if the main tank dies, and agro ping pongs all over, if most of your group is damaged, throw it out there. If you are fighting one raid mob, no adds, and than MT (and RT if that's the case) are the only ones taking damage, then its a bit useless, sure.

[AnimocityStromm]

For mobs with an AE, Zefveer's can be a nice save for your group's healer's mana in a raid

Grummus is a good example of an encounter where Zevfeer's is very useful. He's got an AE dot you can't hide from. Unless all your casters have Extended Range 4, they're gonna get hit by it, and melees are gonna for sure. A necro in each group can help counter a good chunk of the damage.

[Recluse]

Agnarr the Storm Lord -Bastion of Thunder


Aggy is one the funnest planar raids I've been through so far. It's semi long but every fast paced. You'll barely notice the time go by.


A brief break down: Head to court yard and have your raid force meet at the electric dildo in the center of it. Many will be tempted to press the deal to see if the storm warder's come to life. I can assure you they do -stay away from it. Buff you raiding force here. You must ascent Torden to get to Agnarr. There are three levels. In each mobs are already spawned along with a mini boss and four portals. Each portal spawns bosses. When your raid force enters each level they must destroy the portals asap or else they will keep getting adds. Wizards get a nifty spell like our exile undead or magican/druid's exile summoned that will make short work of those portals. However, it does have a high resist so if the spell should fail be prepared to jump on the portals and take them out. They will all con green to you but have a lot of hit points. On the third level of Torden where Agnarr is there is a fifth portal that can not be destroyed. More on that later.


Once your raid force is buffed have someone unlock the dildo and send a bard in first. They will begin kiting all the mobs that are already spawned. Wait a few seconds then send in the rest of the raid force once the bard has agro. Assign and ench and wizard to each portal. Have the ench tash and the wizzy exile. If exile should be resisted, the wizard will call it out. The raid force should instantly move to the portal and finsih it off.


After the portals have been destroyed move on to the regular mobs while the bard continues to kite the named. A knight will tank these. Let him pick them off from the bard kite and take them out as quickly as possible. Once all regular mobs are done move onto the named.


When the first floor of Torden is done quickly rebuff and ascend to the 2nd level. The strat on floor two is pretty much the same. The boss up here is much harder though. He has a nasty fire based dot and an insane amount of hp's. Dot him well and keep lifetap going if you get hit by his dot.


Finally you come to Agnarr. Before you ascend to the final level of Torden send in two kiters this time. One will take the mobs and mini boss while the other will kite Agnarr himself. Follow the same strat as the first two floors: destroy portals, kill reg mobs and then mini before you engage Agnarr. As previously stated there is a fifth portal on this floor that is undestroyable. Once you begin engaging Agnarr and new mini boss will spawn out of it when Aggy gets to 75%, 50% and 25% health. For the first two have the entitre raiding force excpet for the mt, rt and ch rotation jump onto the mini. For the 3rd, have a bard kite it till Agnarr is dead.


Agnarr in and of himself is pretty gimp. His resists are nothing to write home about -everything should land without much difficulty. The only annoying part of the encounter is a aoe mana tap he casts but that can easily be resisted with a bard playing resist songs near by.


My Tips:

-Keep ToM memmed till you get to Aggy. I usually chain nuke with it and Nuero. A lot of the Agnarr encounter is about killing adds before they can deplete your healers' mana pool. Kill as quickly as possible

-Watch out for Agnarr while you're clearing his floor. I got to close to him while he was being kited once and got waxed. In general be aware of where he is at all times

-Stay near a bard for the Aggy engagement. As previously stated his aoe mana tap can be really annoying and my magic resist is the only one that isn't over a 100 unbuffed:(

-Keep people away from the dildo. Every Agnarr raid someone will be the dumb ass that will threaten to click on it before it has been unlucked while others egg him on. One time half our raid force was wiped because someone actually went through with it. The raid force was unbuffed and a lot were afk while mgb's were being set up. All of the sudden four storm warders are on us. Keep the children restrained.


Spells that work:

-Horror
-BoT
-FPoK
-ToM
-SK
-Nuero

I'm assuming DP will land as well. Again, Aggy has low resists. Landing spells won't be a problem.

[Recluse]

Thank you, I can see the use of Zeevfer's for mobs with aoe dot's... but I'm still not sold on the other scenarios. In my experience if a mt dies and and another tank can't pick up agro instantly people are going to die left and right -an 80 point heal isn't going to save them. As for for fights where there will be a lot of adds... yeah, I could see myself using it I had the mana. But until then I think I'll be of more use dealing damage than casting an 80 hp a tick heal on someone fighting a mob that hits for 900.

[Recluse]

K, here's something I'm curious about:


Do you guys use your pets in raids?


I personally every rarely break boner out for a raid. I've found that in the cases of many bosses he can seriously screw up postioning. In addition, after the dirext x 9 catch Boner has been having a nasty habit of pushing mobs into the walls on my server. My guild's first attempt on LMM was a wipe because the magician pets forced him into the wall and it was impossible for anyone to hit/nuke him for almost a minute.

In general I find the pet to be useless for much of the raid. He's nice dps for the bosses but in addition to previously mentioned diasters I find it bothersome to cast and buff a pet before a boss is pulled. Sometimes my mana has not recovered in time for the encounter. If I had the suspend minion aa I could see maybe breaking boner out for boss encounters but other wise I just don't feel he's worth casting *shrug*.