Willful Death AA

[Brantes]

Willful death a waste of 25AA.

I have not had this work 1 time in the past 5 days. I have even had mobs keep coming for me withtou even getting a broken FD message. Why give us willful death if it isnt going to work. I would still love to donkey punch the guy who programmed the pet hold that doesn't wor k for squat. When I say HOLD i mean friggen just that, dont do anything. THat doesnt mean jump on the first caster mobt o cast something at me. Hold means hold. THat needs fixed too.

[Felicite]

Originally posted by Brantes@Mar 22 2006, 11:04 AM
Willful death a waste of 25AA.

I have not had this work 1 time in the past 5 days. I have even had mobs keep coming for me withtou even getting a broken FD message. Why give us willful death if it isnt going to work. I would still love to donkey punch the guy who programmed the pet hold that doesn't wor k for squat. When I say HOLD i mean friggen just that, dont do anything. THat doesnt mean jump on the first caster mobt o cast something at me. Hold means hold. THat needs fixed too.
Did you try using the correct Aura?

*giggle*

*hide*

[sauruman]

I agree both need to be fixed. Both are actually on the top ten list atm too... Not to mention all the threads I've made in dev forum on this ;) . Now that the expansion is finally in... some of these issues will see more attention. I'll start another thread just to make sure.

On the positive side, willful death has saved my ass a few times. Its a shot in the dark with quite the slim chance true, but when it works, its beautiful. It should work at a much higher frequency I think all nec's can agree, and we'll continue to push for that.

[Mallakith]

Higher frequency?

Monks get 100% success if resist 50% success if not. WE should get the same.

If they're THAT concerned about a rez class being fd 100% if resist 20% if not.

Thats the lowest I would consider acceptable anything else I want my aa's back. I could buy innate planar wisdom with it... which is more use atm!

[Xelgadis]

No, there is no bargaining, plain and simple. 100/50. Monks got it during GoD with Stonewall, Rogues got it during OoW with Nerves of Steel, why should we even be remotely satisfied with anything less than the same? This affects not only necromancers, but shadow knights as well, and they would no doubt appreciate the same chance as monks/rogues as well.

[Mallakith]

Actually yeah i prefer to be led...100/50 or nothing!!!

/breaks out the placards

PS last Anguish signet obtained last night wooo nice gear :)

[Brantes]

After 25AA to have virtually no chance is BS. I want 100/50 too, or I can take my 25 AAs and get the entire next leg of avoidance or mitigation.

[Felicite]

Originally posted by Brantes@Mar 24 2006, 10:46 AM
After 25AA to have virtually no chance is BS. I want 100/50 too, or I can take my 25 AAs and get the entire next leg of avoidance or mitigation.
All and all.. it's just another.. brick.. in the wall.

Just refund the shit.

I loved the eventual Gift of Mana/Abundant Healing fix for the Clerics. After six months of investigation, they remove Abundant Healing and refund the AA. Genius.

Brantes. Love you man, been there. After 3 weeks of putting all my Leadership AA into "Inpect Buffs 1 and 2" so I can check buff timers.. they put in the buff timers for all. I ask for refund, and I get "We cannot give you back the LAA you spent". "But you changed the game and this is not as useful". "No refunds, should have thought before you buy".

Don't fixate on it.. look how long it took to deal with the Clerics, and those AA's were broken. Ours is just.. weak. They will fix it, after the ramp up for next expansion is done. *nods*

And, now you have all the required AA to app Fire and Fury. *nods*

[Jebasiz]

Originally posted by Xelgadis@Mar 23 2006, 02:22 PM
No, there is no bargaining, plain and simple. 100/50. Monks got it during GoD with Stonewall, Rogues got it during OoW with Nerves of Steel, why should we even be remotely satisfied with anything less than the same? This affects not only necromancers, but shadow knights as well, and they would no doubt appreciate the same chance as monks/rogues as well.
Settling at this point, for anything less then what monks and rogues have had (for some time) isn't acceptable. The way they've made encounters, and their adds... a low/slight chance of willfull death working, is just as good as it not working at all.

If AE'ing mobs and the need to FD off agro during or after a fight was not so common-place, a compromise may have been sufficient. Right now, willfull death is *almost* as usefull as the "new fear spells". Thanks for "giving us what we asked for", now read the fine print and make it worth a damn. I don't really care about an AA refund, I'm at ~1200aa's anyway. What I want is the aa's I've already purchased (read: just about all of them), to work adequately when going up against current content.

ANY AA ability that isn't used on a consistent bases, should be reviewed and either improved, or expanded. This should happen between now and the next expansion, not making us wait until the fall to have something to do with our exp. A fix shouldn't take long, I mean how hard is it? Improved lifeburn 1-4, improved Dead mesmerization 1-2-3-4. How about a necromancer high level undead mez? The nuke crit increasing aa being expanded to dot crits(a small increase in dps..but it'd be something). There's quite a few others, but you get the idea. Why do we lose abilities as we "grow in power"?

[Xislaben]

And if they say they don't want necro fd (and sk fd via the same WD aa) to be as good as monks:

Rapid Feign 0/3 3/6/9

This is a passive ability; it does not need to be activated.
You may train this ability at Level 59
Requirements: Must spend 12 ability points in Archetype Abilities.

This ability reduces your reuse time on feign death by 10, 25, and 50 percent.

that and if memory serves the monk FD is nearly instant while ours requires a full second to cast.

[Jebasiz]

Originally posted by Xislaben@Apr 6 2006, 02:01 PM
And if they say they don't want necro fd (and sk fd via the same WD aa) to be as good as monks:

Rapid Feign * 0/3 * 3/6/9

This is a passive ability; it does not need to be activated.
You may train this ability at Level 59
Requirements: Must spend 12 ability points in Archetype Abilities.

This ability reduces your reuse time on feign death by 10, 25, and 50 percent.

that and if memory serves the monk FD is nearly instant while ours requires a full second to cast.
heh, we get fd at 16, monks at 18, sk's around 40...yet we are the worst at it at level 70 w/max aa. Why?

[taecken]

Having played a monk for the better part of 5 years, i can say: monks suck. FD is the class-defining skill, but that's it really.

I/we have no hps, ac, or any other skills that make us special. We have a weight limit, gear restrictions, and one of our epic mobs can take weeks to spawn (real time, not game hours)

It's pointless to go full bore on a mob, you can't do that kind of dps up without stealing aggro; one quad his and you're dead. i frequently had to tone down my dps or switch to a 2hb so i'd survive the fight

FD fails at 200 skill.

Our dps has been proportionally out of whack since PoP

My point?

Don't diss monks because they get one skill better than we do. It's all they(we) have. They can't solo, or barely get a group.

I do think, however, that FD should never ever fail, if cast. A spell should fail on an interupt or fizzle, but not a"Fallen to the ground" bullshit message.

[sauruman]

Ya I can assure you nobody here is dissing monks. Its part of our gameplan to get willful death up to par, which happens to be an ability similar to what monks/sks have. EQ keeps getting more comple, which tends to mean there is an expanding amount of overlap between classes especially where utility is concerned.

Like I always say when these arguements become a struggle between classes- back us up on our important issues and we'll back you up on yours.

And to reiterate, willful death needs to be increased as a fixed percentage of success rate. At 25% chance to fire it is not reliable. But I can say within the long period of time I've had the aa's trained, it has had its uses.

I think the consensus is away from asking for a refund, but please correct me if I'm wrong.

[Schaeffer]

Originally posted by sauruman@Apr 11 2006, 06:05 PM
I think the consensus is away from asking for a refund, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
I think the only way to be sure fo that is to make a poll...

[Xelgadis]

To a great number of us, regardless of how many AA we have, a refund doesn't resolve the issue we have with this ability. For those of us who are at/near max AA, what good does refunding it do? absolutely nothing.

To fix this ability is one of the easiest things in all of programming to do: Behold 'copy and paste'. Simply copy the "working" code from Stonewall and paste it over the shit that is the "working" code for Willful Death, problem solved. It's a "fix" that would litteraly take less than one minute to do, so what exactly is the holdup? The state of being feigned is the same, regardless if you feigned death using a skill or a spell, so there is absolutely no reason why they can't copy the code. Any excuses they spew at us as to why they can't is utter bullshit, plain and simple.

Not only is this the number one issue on our list, it's also the easiest to fix, by a significant margin. At this point, I'm quite surprised they haven't fixed it yet.

[Mallakith]

agree with xel, they found the copy and paste function easy enough when they introduced the "new" class of berserker only to give us warriors with no taunt.

It is NOT dificult to fix, the code is there already.

[sauruman]

I won't water down this issue with a poll. I sympathize if you want a refund and would rather have spent those aa's elsewhere. But the underlying issue is, it needs to get fixed, it doesn't need to just go away and get treated like something we wish we never had or something. It has potential... lets work with it and get it bumped up. It polled incredibly strongly as a class item, and its something we all want fixed.

[Jebasiz]

This should of been fixed weeks if not months ago.

As much I as try to be able to be fair to you as a class rep (and I fail at it quite frequently) shit like this just makesit impossible. I know you're "very active" on class correspondant boards, even that cocksucker dalnoth told me you are(s credible as he is..how can i question that?!). That still isn't the point, your activity on those boards hasn't lead to any positive change for this community. That makes you ineffective. You need to be concise and adamant that THIS is the ONE thing that MUST change, and it betterfuckingchangerightnow! On those boards.

The PoR spells, heh...I doubt they'll change, with a level increase of 5 possibly 10 levels forthcoming, I also doubt if it even matters at this point. It'll be the new "reflect" spell line, and noone will ever mem this either(the only difference is, we actually are forced to getting this, unlike reflect where people who replaced their ldon augs, only buy reflect after the fact because there's NOTHING to do with those 1000's of LDoN points otherwise).

You're not the complete douche I thought you were, I'm done telling you to quit, stepdown etc..but you do need to come back with an answer or some type of result, or many will start shouting (again)for your removal. It'd be sad to see that happen again. Get us answers and timelines. if an immediate change isn't possible.

[Rijak]

I agree with Xel too. Demand stonewall and see what happens.

[cumadieaneu]

well I have to agree with Jeb on this one plain and simple this AA is totally worthless along with a few others and spells we necros getting shafter or rather getting worse as we grow as someone put it earlier in the post is just about right. I dont have a lot of AA's but I am required to have the certain ones that require me to stay alive on raids in like UQUA, YXXTA, QVIC, etc. but I wont go there for now just get the Damn AA fixed and all will be well.

[Aryse Andenter]

Originally posted by Jebasiz@Apr 17 2006, 03:53 PM

As much I as try to be able to be fair to you as a class rep (and I fail at it quite frequently) shit like this just makesit impossible. I know you're "very active" on class correspondant boards, even that cocksucker dalnoth told me you are(s credible as he is..how can i question that?!).
Dalnoth would eat Sauruman alive (sorry man, but its true).

Seriously, stay the hell away from talking to him, he's not in any circumstances a person who can be reasoned with and he has a completely irrational hatred for our class.

But back on point, have we seen any updates on our list since we got a new rep?

Xelgadis has the fix right for this particular issue.

[Jebasiz]

Dalnoth has the mental capacity of a soda can. Sauruman can actually understand a logical thought process.

Simply pretending things aren't the way they are, doesn't make you effective at arguing.

[cumadieaneu]

well I dont know how much help these so called reps are but all I know is we got some broken stuff and wish they'd get it fixed.

[Xelgadis]

Originally posted by Jebasiz@Apr 17 2006, 09:52 PM
Dalnoth has the mental capacity of a soda can. Sauruman can actually understand a logical thought process.

Simply pretending things aren't the way they are, doesn't make you effective at arguing.
Dalnoth has the potential to be a great debater, if he would pull his head out of his ass long enough to harness the ability to differentiate fact from fiction, but that's neither here nor there.

The timeframe in which Sauruman was selected for his position did work against him. Work on PoR was well underway when that occured, so very few class issues (in general) were really addressed if they hadn't already been on the back burner before then.

Here we are; Prophecy of Ro is out, the developers have cycled through their vacations, Fan Faire is over. The time to push to get things fixed/changed is now, the push has to be hard and it must be in a singular direction. The biggest problem this class has lies not within the game, but within the players' inability to decide. Very rarely do we get even a majority on issues, let alone a super majority or even unanimity. The one thing I believe most all people in the class agree upon (for once) is the fact that Willful Death is a mere shadow of what it was both invisioned and should be. As I stated before, that is the easiest issue to fix, by quite a significant margin. Being that it is #1 on the list, we can get that fixed relatively easy then start attacking the other issues one by one.

[danoob]

Yeah willful death could use a bit of work. It actually does work once in awhile, but never when it actually counts. Plus after all the time spent playing without it, its nearly an automatic reflex to stand and reFD. Usually about the time I'm FD'ing again it's dawned on me that WD had worked :blink:

Better safe than ranger gate, as WD is to unreliable in its current form.

[Xheng]

Originally posted by danoob@Apr 21 2006, 09:17 AM
Plus after all the time spent playing without it, its nearly an automatic reflex to stand and reFD. Usually about the time I'm FD'ing again it's dawned on me that WD had worked :blink:

To get any value at all out of Willful Death, I had to break that habit. What worked for me was to set up an audio trigger keyed to the text that scolls by when feign is broken. Now I reflexively stand and drop to Homer's D'Oh!, instead.

It's not entirely worthless... any chance at all of living to save a raid is better than none... but it's clearly in need of major reworking to be of any real use.

A 25% chance might be decent if the game mechanics were different, but when you have multiple AEs going off (which sadly is the norm) the probability of it being useful goes down fast. That becomes a 6% chance after 2 AEs... 1.5% after 3... and so low as to be altogether negligible after that.

I support "fixing it" 's position as our #1 Class Item.